Baron Thomas MacPaul the Younger Baron Thomas MacPaul the Younger

Minutes from 03-03-01 - Fighters School

Stallari Council Meeting, March 3, 2001

Meeting held at Fighter School

Hosted by the Barony of Windhaven

In Attendance: HSH Saeric Scireham (Steve Traylor), Prince of Northshield, HSH Yasamin al-Hadiyya, (Stephanie Skaff), Princess of Northshield, HE Kenneth die Katze (Ken Balder), Lord Heir of Northshield, HE Leyla ibnat ash-Shamaal (Peg Blader), Lady Heir of Northshield, THL Lewina of Sussex (Lauretta Wenger), Seneschal, Lady Moira McVey (Mary Kay Roberts) Exchequer, THL Julio Gava'n, James Kruse, Principality Earl Marshal, and Lady Tatiana Marana Melville (Tonia Heng) Chirurgeon HE Fiona nic Aoidh (Lorine Horvath), and Lady Ravenna ingen A'eda (Robyn Quandt).

Minutes were taken by Baroness Marisela the Vintner (Barbara White-Coenen), Stallari Council Secretary.

The meeting was called to order at 7:25 p.m.


Boar's Head - December 10, 2000- Moved, seconded and approved.

12th Night - January 28, 2001 - Moved, seconded and approved.

  • Old Business
  • Inter-kingdom events
  • HL Julio stated that we need to talk to local groups about the advantages / disadvantages of having an inter-kingdom event and publish the reasons. HSH Yasamin said we should team up with the Kingdom Seneschal. It was agreed yes. HL Lewina offered suggestions on what needs to be determined by the bidding group before making a decision to host this type of an event. HSH Saeric said he has spoken to former kings about this but it is the responsibility of the MidRealm to decide the rules for inter-kingdom play. Most current rules are based on Pennsic. HL Richard said we should wait for a response from the Kingdom Seneschal before we go much further on this. HSH Yasamin said that we can still talk to groups to see what interest there is. THL Julio said that the last time the Kingdom of Calontir had real problems with some of our rules. HE Fiona stated that the local group has no understanding of the process of having an inter-kingdom event.
  • Steering Committee
  • (Name change, see Sen. Report page 13) - HL Lewina there is a discrepancy in the eligibility of candidates and that this clears it up. These are the changes that she found in the existing document that needed corrections. HSH Yasamin said there are other things that should be changed in there. The straw poll should not be listed as an official straw poll as by definition straw polls are not official. HSH Yasamin felt it should just say official poll. HSH Yasamin said that regarding the subcommittees that subcommittees or workgroups cannot include additional people. As a subcommittee per Roberts rules it must contain members of the actual committee. She felt that the wording needs to be changed.
  • (Corrections in membership, see Sen. Report page ) - HSH Yasamin said that she has seen discussion on the Northshield Hall expressing concern about turning over 1/3 of the exploratory group every 6 months as this would be too disruptive. HL Lewina stated that this is how the BOD does it. After general discussion it was the feeling that it will take more than one term of each officer to complete the kingdom exploratory process. The perception on the Hall is that this would be a method of stalling the process. HSH Yasamin would not like the entire membership to change in 2 years. She stated that something in the middle is needed. THL Richard suggested 1, 2, 3 year terms. HE Leyla suggested perhaps the current KEG member should be given the option to extend their term. HE Fiona said that this would then give the Coronet the option to review that KEG members position. HL Lewina asked for clarification. HE Fiona suggested that the Stallari leave it to the Coronet to make the decision whether to keep a member on the committee or not. She suggested a confirmation of commitment from the committee member to the Coronet asking to continue in the capacity of the office might be a good idea. Lady Moira said that if the perception is that we are trying to delay this then this change could also be perceived the same way, even more so. HE Fiona stated we need to make this a perceptual tool so that the people become more aware that the Coronet has the ability to change it all.
  • Policies and Procedures for Changing of Officers
  • (See Sen. report page 12 & 14) - HL Lewina said that there was a mistake in the eligibility (see pg 14) and that this now reflects the correct version of the procedures. She said that this is not in the Northshield laws issue recently published. HL Lewina said this is something that has been presented before to the Stallari but never decided on. HSH Yasamin asked if the current Kingdom law covers this same thing stating that The Pale is required. HL Lewina said yes. HSH Yasamin stated no harm in being redundant on this. As it's a policy HSH Yasamin said go. HL Lewina will give it to Lady Ravenna to publish.
  • Trust Fund
  • Mistress Guenievre du Dragon Vert (Jennifer Dark) has some resources for non-profit investing. HSH Yasamin wants herself, HL Lewina, HSH Saeric, and Lady Moira to talk to this person. Lady Moira brought up the fact that Kingdom has said no to any new accounts. HSH Yasamin said she talked to Lord Aidan Blackstone (David Young) Kingdom Exchequer and he referred them to corporate. HSH Saeric said that he talked to Lord Grimmund Blackwing (Dan Long) regarding this and he felt there is the possibility of incorporating the trust fund separately. HSH Yasamin feels we'll have problem getting contributions if done that way. HE Leyla said we still need to investigate this for the future (based on us as a kingdom). HSH Yasamin said the person in question is involved in non-profit investing and fund-raising. HSH Saeric said we should have pre-printed forms available for those wishing to make a contribution to the trust fund. Lady Moira said this has already been discussed. She is keeping track of mundane names and the amount donated. HSH Yasamin said this should be forwarded to Lady Ravenna for publication. HSH Saeric asked for a running total on the amount in the Northwatch sort of like a thermometer slowly going up.
  • Update on "Concussion Flyer, Heat Strokes, Injury pamphlet, etc
  • Lady Tatiana stated that she really doesn't have anything new but will post anything to the hall.
  • Coronet bid packet
  • HE Leyla asked if the deadline was 3/31/01. She said a nice bid was received from Inner Sea. HL Lewina stated that the agreed deadline was 3/15/01. HSH Yasamin said that if the bid looks good we will all look over it for approval.
  • New Business
  • Change of dates for Coronet/Investiture
  • HSH Yasamin discussed putting the dates as the middle to the end of May and from the end of September to the end of October. She asked if we could do this the later half of October. HE Leyla said that we should be able to dodge Kingdom's crown tournament date and still make it work as Kingdom decides their dates so far in advance. HE Leyla suggested April and September like Ealdomere used to have. That would put us in the same block as Coronation. HL Lewina said there has been a lot of talk about this. HSH Yasamin said that perhaps the Northwatch could put a note out on this stating that we're evaluating changing the Coronet dates. HSH Yasamin said the earliest we could do this is the June 2002 reign. THL Richard said this gives fighters in that tournament the ability to know that their reign will be affected.
  • Fall Coronet/Investiture bid
  • The rewrite of the bid procedure is in process. HL Lewina said she is taking out the personalization that was in the previous document and also looking to this as if we were talking about this as a possible Principality event bid packet.
  • Pavilion (under Exchequer)
  • Their Highnesses
  • HSH Saeric brought up that there is a new place on the website for help wanted.
  • HSH Yasamin said she is trying to go through and clarify how we make policy - what's law, what's tradition, etc. The Kingdom Exploratory Group process was kind of a special one but handling every policy like this would get a little messy. Lady Tatiana asked Her Highness if due to the changes Their Highnesses have made to the policy since the discussions with Stallari do we now need to re-clarify this in policy. HL Lewina felt that the section on bringing it to Stallari as advisory council should be left in. HSH Yasamin said that the Coronet always has the right to do anything without advice of Council. HSH Yasamin said that because we've only had to do this (Kingdom Exploratory Group) once, from now on policy making should be consistent as the part concerning the creation of the KEG will never be used again.
  • Lord and Lady Heirs
  • In the interest of time we'll do things on the list


  • Minister of Children
  • HL Lewina has received a second application. HSH Yasamin said that she thought this was a go. Generally agreed that it was.
  • Crown
  • Possibility for a Stallari meeting and we could consider inviting the MidRealm Royals.
  • HE Leyla stated that there will probably not be a Curia at this, but the King and Queen may change Their minds. She stated that for Curia quorum they need The King, The Queen, the Seneschal and three Greater Officers. HSH Yasamin said that as this is a two day event, it would be nice to have a Stallari meeting at Crown. HE Fiona suggested that the day of A&S would be a better day as A&S is set to end at 7 p.m.
  • New Seneschal list
  • The new Seneschal list has been set up as well as the Stallari lists and everything appears to be working okay. HSH Yasamin asked to be put on the Seneschal list.
  • HL Lewina stated that her emergency replacement as Seneschal is THL Kateline atte Water
    (Lynn M. Olson) the Deputy Seneschal of the Althing.
  • Chatelaine
  • The Chatelaine is accepting applications with a deadline of Sept 15th. He will be stepping down at Boar's Head. HSH Yasamin questioned the length of time he has been in the office. HL Lewina said he will have been in for 2 years at the time he steps down.
  • Newcomer Event/Suspension
  • HL Lewina stated that we'll come back to this in the Exchequers report.
  • Event Location packet
  • HL Lewina said that she would like this on the Northshield website. She said that this was well put together and it is just wonderful. HE Fiona said this is a packet for finding / managing prospective sites. HL Lewina said she would like to have this on the web so that people can pull it off and use it.
  • SCA Principality Handbook
  • Still awaiting Kingdom approval.
  • HL Lewina said that there is really little material available on the web, or if it is we need permission to use it. She said that the book was put together by a woman in Jararvellir for new people. Lady Moira said it's like a newcomers book for really new people. HL Lewina said that she is still waiting for Kingdom to look at it.


HL Lewina stated that she would like a copy of the monthly calendar of TSH and TE so she will know what events they will be attending.

  • Memberships
  • Only corporate can sell memberships at this time
  • Obstacles and resolutions (see page 8 in Sen. report)
  • Membership of Principality (see page 1. of Sen. Report)
  • Royal and Officers remarks (see page 2 & 3 of Sen. Report)
  • Committee Deputies (see page 11 in Sen. Report)
  • Branch Reporting (see page19 in Sen. Report)
  • State of the Principality (see page 20 in Sen. Report)
  • Small changes in laws



The Shire of Rockhaven is under suspension and her understanding is that the Barony of Nordskogen was going to do their event. HSH Yasamin said that that is how Dance Seminar works is that Nordskogen is acting as the sponsor.

Regarding the Shire of Coldedernhale, the Seneschal and Exchequer are meeting this weekend to discuss the groups suspension and other issues.

  • The Shire of Inner Sea is in suspension. This is a concern as they are bidding on doing Coronet. A copy of their Domesday was sent to HL Lewina but not to Kingdom.
  • The Shire of Mare Amethystinum is in suspension. Lady Tatiana mentioned that they have had a recent changeover in their Seneschal. HL Lewina said that it is clearly on the web what the deadlines are and everyone knows Domesdays are due because it's also in the Northwatch and it's in the Pale.
  • HL Lewina stated that she gave people the benefit of the doubt if they made a reasonable attempt to get this done. Based on Maestra Arianna Llwyd (Marilee Lloyd) Kingdom Seneschal thoughts regarding those groups on suspension for the lack of the exchequers Domesday, she suggested that if someone else offers to run the event the Stallari Council can let them do it. A retraction does not have to be published for any previously published event, it can just drop off the calendar.

Pavilion (rental fees & deposits, RUM)

  • Quest for Camelot has asked for the pavilion for this event. HE Fiona said at Quest for Camelot the court, feast and A&S will be outside if the pavilion is not available.
  • Lady Moira would like to see some kind of policy set for this. She said that the deposit check would not be cashed and returned if the pavilion was not damaged. HE Leyla asked how we define damage. Lady Moira stated negligence not damage due to weather. HSH Yasamin asked how much is it the responsibility of the sponsoring group to dry it out, etc as the pavilion is so big they can't put it up in the back yard. HSH Yasamin and the Council agreed that a deposit in principal is important. HE Fiona stated that the size of the deposit could be a problem. Lady Moira suggested $250. It was generally agreed this was a reasonable deposit.
  • Lady Moira stated the general fund gave the Principality a loan with the agreement that it gets paid back.
  • Lady Moira asked if we need to designate a Deputy for the painting of the dags. HSH Yasamin said lets go to Nordskogen on this as they painted the top of the pavilion.
  • HE Fiona asked how are we going to determine the rental cost. It was suggested $100 for one event. HE Kenneth suggested that the rent continue to be collected until the pavilion is paid for but then the amount of rent should be reduced once payment in full has been made.
  • Lady Tatiana suggested that the group renting it should be held responsible for the transport. Lady Moira didn't think it feasible for a specific person to be held responsible for that. HE Fiona stated that the Stallari decided when the original position to care for it was created, that the person holding the position was also responsible for the transportation of the pavilion. HSH Yasamin said that private arrangements for transportation can be made temporarily until the status of the officer position is determined.


The risograph when used for printing for fund-raising purposes needs to be reimbursed. Lady Aldiana is still doing the Northshield directory using the risograph. It was suggested that a 50-50 split between the Northwatch fund and the trust fund be used for the reimbursement. HSH Yasamin asked for information dollar wise regarding the costs and the suggested splits.

The Shire of Korsvag does not want to be expected to continue collating this literature if the risograph is being used for fundraising purposes. Lady Ravenna stated that a clear definition of how this is going to be done needs to be posted so that those using the risograph know what is and is not included with the printing.

General report

See enclosed.

The regalia database is being redone. Lady Giovanna has done some repairs and the cloaks are going to be dry-cleaned.

The cheapest storage facility is going to run 90 dollars per month. There was general discussion on the value of the storage facility. General agreement we should go ahead with storage unit at $90 per month.

HE Fiona stated the Seneschal, the Exchequer and TSH have to approve spending when it is for other than budgeted amounts. HSH Yasamin stated that Kingdom Curia has it that expenses over $100 need to be approved. There was general discussion on the dollar amount that could be spent before approval was required. HSH Yasamin read out loud the law as written which states that the Exchequers approval is not needed. HSH Yasamin said she wanted to see something that states the Exchequer must be part of the decision making process. Lady Moira stated that she would prefer $50 as the spending limit due to the size of the Principality's operating budget vs. the size of Kingdoms budget. HSH Yasamin said that she'd like to see anything that states that a non-budgeted item requires Stallari approval. She further clarified that the rules as they are now state that unless it's an emergency, the Coronet needs to consult the Stallari but that the Coronet makes the decision. She further stated that currently there is no procedure requiring a full Stallari vote. Lady Moira asked if it is in MidRealm law does it apply to us. HSH Yasamin said no, as the law specifically states Curia. If not an emergency than $50 is agreed.


  • Laws
  • They can now be updated on the web as they have been published in an official document. Lady Ravenna asked if we should sell the issues as a fund raiser or do we do a laws issue. Lady Moira asked if we need a separate issue if they've already been published. HSH Yasamin asked for her clarification if all the changes have been done and published. HL Lewina said yes with the exception of what we are discussing now or is currently is process. Lady Ravenna will publish in the Northwatch new updates and not all the Northshield laws.
  • Seneschal Updates for Publication on the Web
  • HL Lewina brought up discussion of copyright law requirements and that these should be listed on the web. Such as how to deal with press releases and other published documents. HL Lewina brought up discussion on the dangers of linking and re-writing articles without the authors permission due to these copyright laws.
  • She also asked that the Sponsorship form and the Change of Officer forms get posted for downloading. She asked that an explanation of the officer change over procedure needs to be stated on the web. It needs to state that these forms must be signed, filed out correctly and mailed to their appropriate officers. She would also like to see the address of the retiring officer and the new officer get posted.
  • Lord Randall seems to be getting the updates posted.
  • Domesday summary - see her report
  • Postage
  • Court Reports


Accepting applications for position


Youth Combat

We received $125 from Kingdom for this. HL Julio asked for discussion to allow for the purchase of more equipment which would cost around $75. HSH Yasamin said no discussion was needed. TSH and HL Lewina agreed to the expense.

Inter-kingdom events were previously discussed.


The request for applicants will be in the next Northwatch.


The Northshield warranted chirurgeons webpage will be linked from the Kingdom webpage. Northshield people are not on the Kingdom page so the link will take them to the appropriate Northshield page.

She stated that a surprising number of expirations have taken place.

Next meeting

HSH Yasamin asked if HL Lewina could ask Maestra Arianna if there is a substitute for the Seneschal that could be sent to a meeting in the event the Seneschal can't make it. It was stated that a meeting is unofficial and no decisions can be made if the Seneschal is not present. HE Fiona stated you can talk about things at a meeting and then consult on decisions with HL Lewina. HSH Yasamin stated she'd like to have a meeting to discuss and exchange information at RUM. Lady Ravenna suggested that everyone's calendars and agenda get put on the Stallari list. HSH Yasamin said she would like face time at A&S as an unofficial meeting. She suggested that HL Lewina should find out what if the Seneschal is unable to make it to a meeting, what can the Stallari do to still have a meeting.

The meeting adjourned at 9:25 p.m.

Posted by: Elaine de Beauchamp Council Secretary (KLO) on 3/3/2001

This site is © 2022 Kingdom of Northshield. Original contributors retain the copyright of certain portions of this site.